Kidnapped?

Discussion in 'Living in Cancun' started by 4NSPY, Dec 10, 2009.

  1. 4NSPY

    4NSPY Guest

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    At least he's out of Jail!
     
  2. KTDLP

    KTDLP Enthusiast Registered Member

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    I don't know where you get your information from but I know that Farrat was in the hospital unconscious for more than one month after the incident. Unless someone brought his lifeless body out of the hospital to a club, you must have seen his identical twin brother (no joke, he really has an identical twin brother).

    Also, you have obviously never seen or spoken to him because he is permanently damaged in the face and brain.

    His older brother was not elected, he was appointed. City council is not chosen by the people, it is chosen by the party. And Regidor (city) is a lower position than his previous of Diputado (state). He would have been running for Senator (federal) this last election if his family would not have been accused of corruption and had their name dragged through the mud.

    Police relevance in this case is because of the charge, excessive use of force. Google it. All News articles relating to Free's charge are probably about police brutality.

    And 14 months in jail without charges is not laughable, it is the law here. The state's attorney wasn't just sitting around. They were collecting evidence and witness testimony. The reason he wasn't released was because his crime does not allow bail because of it's gravity. Maybe Free should have done his research on the judicial system here before he applied for residency.

    What saddens me is that whenever a foreigner is unhappy with the system here in Mexico they automatically throw out accusations of corruption. Whether you like the way the system here works or not, this case would have had the same outcome anywhere else in the world. EXCESSIVE USE OF FORCE.

    Paying protection money in the prisons is supporting corruption. So is paying the media. (o;

    Free is not an innocent victim of corruption here in Mexico that lost 2 years of his life in prison. He is a man that smashed in another man's skull with his foot and damaged him for THE REST OF HIS LIFE. Get it right.
     
  3. rawkus

    rawkus I can choose my own title Registered Member

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    Farrat or Ferrat...?

    My bad, havent really checked into how the political system works, and used the word elected. Thanks for the info :)

    Also, maybe Ivan should have thought about what COULD happen if you push someone on the floor, 3 times over, to initiate a fight...?

    Of course this is not black and white, but what bugs me is that he initiated it all, and thus has some responsibility. Free is not completely innocent, but neither is Ivan, who, bit of quite more than he could actually chew...

    IF Ivan had never started the fight, none of this would have happened...

    He did and it bit him in the behind, big time.

    Now, Im NOT justifying excessive violence at all, but I do understand why Free reacted. Back home(Sweden) one has the right to "defend oneself to whatever extent deemed necessary to protect ones own life/health".

    Obviously this does NOT mean smashing someone to bits when that person is already down, but it gives a person, who like Free, is being attacked, the right to "incapacitate" the aggressor, be it 2 punches in the face or a kick in the head.

    What I want to see is that appropriate means are taken against Ivan as soon as he is "healthy enough".

    He initiated it and is thus responsible - simple as that.

    Free is paying for HIS part - its time that Ivan does the same, dont you think? And no, getting injured for something YOU brought on yourself is NOT paying for it towards Free. ;)

    From what Ive read(many various sources) it seems to be a LOT of "under the table" stuff involved... That there is no corruption in this case, I just cant even pretend to believe.

    To try to sum up what I think:

    Two parts in this: Free and Ivan.

    1: Free has served 14 months.

    2: Ivan? Nothing.

    3: Hes injured? yes, but he brought it on himself. Maybe he should have done his research on street brawls and how they lack "rules and regulations", before jumping on a guy, especially when all parties are drunk of their heads...?

    I also still want to hear why they changed their minds to dropping charges when it became evident that they/he would have to pay the bills himself...

    The Ferrat`s name was "dragged through the dirt" earlier than this event... They managed to see to that themselves, when his older brother(??) assaulted a tourist...

    I wish all cards will be put on the table one day - I have a feeling there are a LOT of surprises on both sides ;)

    I do assume this is a step in the right direction. At least I hope that...
     
  4. KTDLP

    KTDLP Enthusiast Registered Member

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    The reason Ivan has not served any time is because Free has not pressed charges. We will see what happens with that now that he is out. But for starting a fight here in Cancun, they usually put you in jail overnight. A slap on the wrist if there are no severe damages. Leaving someone permanently damaged carries much heavier consequences.

    I'm sure that you know that the initial complaint was not filed by Ferrat or his family, it was filed by the other guy that was involved in the fight. He made the complaint because his friend was severely injured.

    As to who started the fight, a huge part of the investigation was witness testimony that the fight had started way before the video footage you see.

    I totally agree with you that there are consequences for starting or being involved in a bar fight and BOTH Free and Ferrat suffered those consequences. I don't think that either one of these gentlemen where correct in their actions but I'm absolutely tired of hearing "Free Free." He is a violent criminal that was convicted and released on TIME SERVED. They sentenced him to time in prison. If he would have been able to have been bailed out earlier, he would be starting his two year sentence now. He is not a victim.
     
  5. Steve

    Steve Administrator Owner

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    If Free wasnt charged (or charged only just recently) there is no crime and should be no sentence. Of course putting someone in jail for so long without charge is an appalling abuse of human rights. Sure, being held on remand pending trial is a totally different matter but the thing is he was not even charged with any crime. Why was this?

    Fact is if Ferat hadn't started it with his friends (4 or 5 vs 2 wasnt it) he'd not got himself hurt. If someone is trying to attack you you do whatever you can to defend yourself and incapacitate your assailiant, you dont stand there and ponder the pros and cons of reasonable force, you act instinctively and the instinct is to preserve your own life.
     
  6. Steve

    Steve Administrator Owner

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    He's a twentysomething guy who went out for a few beers, got drunk and got into a fight. No more, no less.
     
  7. KTDLP

    KTDLP Enthusiast Registered Member

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    No he is a twenty something year old guy that put a crack into someone else's skull and was convicted of using excessive force.

    The way the judicial system works here is that if you are accused of something (using excessive force) and there is sufficient evidence (Ferrat in the hospital, in a comma, with a cracked skull) they can hold you. It is called an orden de detencion. This is like being "charged." To get this order, there must be sufficient evidence. Then you have the chance to defend yourself. The problem in this case is that his mother tampered with evidence (the videos) that could not be admitted and he changed his lawyers 3 times. Even with those tapes it is debatable about what would have happened because the evidence for this charge was Ferrats physical state not who started a bar fight. The reason he was not released was because they had an orden de detension for a crime that does not allow bail.

    I think the problem is the direct translation of judicial and legal terms. He was not held with no evidence. Charged is more like "acusado" and convicted is more like "senteciado." Here they translate charged as what we would call convicted.


    If this had happened to someone that you know and love, you would not be defending Free. And if he was a local he would have been treated exactly the same way.

    And I repeat, he was convicted of his crime and sentenced to time in prison (time served), a fine, and moral fines to the family. So, he was not FREED from prison. He is a convicted felon.
     
  8. KTDLP

    KTDLP Enthusiast Registered Member

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    Let's not be so dramatic. Your instinct to defend your life? Didn't you just say it was just a bar fight?

    In the precious video all of you Free Free supporters hold dear, there are only 2 men on 2 men. Also in this video Ferrat only pushes Free. If repeatedly stomping someone's head into the ground is your fight or flight response, there are some deeply rooted problems there. He also obviously runs back to Ferrat after Ferrat had left him alone when he knocked him out and then continued to smash in his skull, after he was already unconscious!
     
  9. rawkus

    rawkus I can choose my own title Registered Member

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    In the video we all saw, Ivan pushes Free several times, making Free fall down on to the floor...

    He initiated it, no matter how much of a friend of Ivan`s you are(??).

    Simple: If he hadnt started it, he never would have gotten his "skull bashed in".

    Just because you LOSE a fight you started, doesnt mean you are innocent, right?

    Ivan hopefully learned a lesson, but had to pay BIG time. But, in many bar fights, people actually get killed, so it could have been even worse.

    Free served/is serving his time - Its time that Ivan will do the same. he is the aggressor, provoker and initiator - he brought it on himself.

    Saying "its just a bar fight" is useless, since A: Testosterone, B: Alcohol and C: No laws, no rules, no regulations...

    Thats why bar/street brawls are what they are.

    If one is NOT prepared, then one should NOT engage.

    If it was my friend/brother etc who started the fight, then ended up getting smashed, well, facts dont change: "My brother/friend" started it and has himself to blame for bringing it on to himself.

    Sure Id be upset, but if one cant handle alcohol and stuff like this, then one should not go out and especially NOT start fights, regardless the "reason"...

    Sad event, all in all... Once Ivan gets to pay for HIS part, then things can move on. Until then: Unfair like h*ll.

    Sad but true.

    By the way, the video show Free being pushed down no less than 3 times, the last he flies out of the screen...

    At this point, its two guys against him, but seconds later Free`s friend comes running back.

    In Sweden, he would have had the right to hit back after push number 1...

    Im thinking what would have happened if they were all sober...?
     
  10. rawkus

    rawkus I can choose my own title Registered Member

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    I sure do hope Free charges Ivan with initiating the fight etc.

    I believe this is the only way Ivan could ever do time/pay fines for his part of it all, right?
     
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